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Views 344  l   Votes 2  l   2019.03.03 21:47

Ive got a sneaking feeling that this game is a bit broken.   [45]

Bonus-Jones    Lv.  1
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    So, my FC team of 4 blues (Athena, Dino, Karl and Akasha) and 1 green (ice witch) lost to a single Robin.

    I get it, "good runes and maxed out hunters are pretty strong and can beat a beginner team".

    But
    1. Should someone with clearly very end game character even match up against a newbie who has played the game for just a few months?
    2. In a balanced game, 1 unit should not wipe out a full team of same tier units.
    3. Do the devs ever make any balance fixes to the game? Ive seen 2 new hunters added, and Papillon got changed up, but Robin has clearly been dominant for a very long time.

    Or am i totally in the wrong here, and the answer is to "just play more and it magically gets better at some point".
    • Fukurama 2019.03.03 22:51
      generally a 5☆ hunter beats 5 4☆ hunters.
      transcendance level is also very descisive in the same way.
      Equipment/Jewels also VERY important
      ...
      Now to the team ur using.
      Karl and Athena is actually two of the worst hunters for PvP out there (as offence goes) *Octavia not great either.
      No wonder you are having trouble.
      ...
      PvP tiers as following
      Top 3☆ hunters (roles)
      Attackers:Beckhen, Bibi, Hermes, Heidi, (Yuri)
      Defenders: --- NEVER USE THESE IN OFFENCE TEAMS
      Bombers: Jack'o'Lantern, Dino, Patrone, Diana (Metis), (((Juno??? dunno)))
      Healers: Akasha OP, (Joy)
      ...
      If anything. the game is more balanced than it has been before, etc. the bomber 50/50 coin flip meta, the unbreakable Athena wall of china meta, Dumble Trouble.
      yes. they have balance patches more frequently than ever. bad characters gets buffs all the time.. so no. game is NOT broken.
    • Tohriu 2019.03.03 23:49
      Buh Juno ain't a bomber...
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.04 03:24
      First of all, unless im terribly mistaken, my team is 4 5stars and 1 4star.

      Second, the only way i can get more manda to get more hunters is to play the fight club, since it pays up 300 at the end of the week, giving me roughly 1 10 pull every week.

      So im forced to fight in the FC with the hunters ive pulled, and these were what i got. It took me this far to get these.
      So why im going against someone who can wipe out my entire team with a single guy?
      Because the game is broken. In a game that is balanced and fair, my opponents would be other people who have a team of just a random collection of hunters, as in people who are at the same level as me.

      And you say the game is more balanced than ever, yet you were able to say that some hunters clearly are better than others regardless of team composition, a sign of an unbalanced game with a stale meta.

      So not only did you fail counter my argument of a broken matchup system, you successfully proved that the game is not well balanced.

      Well done.
    • -MsArtsSmith- 2019.03.04 06:43
      Ive checked out your bio squad and saw none of them are even t3 so less complaining more playing
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:17
      Its a 2 part critique, maybe read the second ond too yeah?
    • Tohriu 2019.03.04 15:12
      Transcending hunters are a must
      If Arth statement is correct, you don't have any of your hunters at least on transcendence 1... Most likely the reason you lost to the Robin which was probably T3
      T1 = takes one of the same hunter
      T2 = takes two of the same hunter
      T3 = takes three of the same hunter

      So that Robin which is 5* got transcended by 6 more other Robins which is why it's a lot stronger than your other non transcended units
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:19
      So maybe i shouldnt get matched up againsta someone who has been able to transcend someone to the max.
    • Nazure 2019.03.04 17:58
      @Fukurama: "Karl.... worst hunters for PvP"
      - i dont agree with you here.
      - Have you mistaked Karl with Kain (role defense, 3* thunder)?
      - I use Karl to hit defensive team using immunity-dodger Beckhen everyday - w/o Karl, i have more trouble to win PvP.

      So feel really offended when see you saying Karl worst at PvP =_=
      kindly revise.
    • Tohriu 2019.03.03 23:48
      First of all...
      Robin is a natural 1*
      Second of all
      He is easy to get = not end game hunter
      Third of all
      Robin is a tank so he will be hard to kill, also you're saying this is just a Robin, imagine if it had 4 other hunters with it, that's what we have to deal in the higher ranks
      Each role has it's own benefits, you just need to read up on some skills and you'll be fine

      P.S. you should not be focusing on fc right now... Your first priority is doing the campaign and earning manda to get your hunters stronger which will help you in the long run for FC, as you have written, you've only been playing for a couple months
    • Tohriu 2019.03.04 00:22
      Here's a list of hunters you'd definitely want to keep
      Attackers
      Bibi, Heidi, Beckhen, Hermes, Yuri, Karl
      Bombers
      Patrone, Dino, Diana, Lantern/Jacko Lantern, Apollon (<-- got nerfed but still worth keeping)
      Support a.k.a. Healers
      Akasha, Therapy, Joy, Pansy, Crocus (<-- mostly used for PvE), Bruce (<-- natural 1*)
      Tanks a.k.a. don't use for offense unless you know what you're doing
      Kain, Athena, Papillon, Harley, Calibur, Edward, Robin(<-- natural 1*)

      Beckhen and Harley obtainable only via traces from FC shop and Mirage shop
      Keep all Natural four stars as well

      I didn't type the newer hunters since there's not enough info
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.04 03:46
      I dont think you understood what i meant with end game hunter.
      End game hunter would be something that is "maxed out and ready for endgame".
      Something veterans of the game that have playednit a lot have, not something someone new to the game (me) would have
      The part where i (a newbie) was matched up with the veteran (someone who has played more than me) is where the game is broken.

      As far as earning manda goes, if i get to high enough tier on FC, i get 300 manda a week + a ton of FC points. And ive managed to get there few weeks now, but i keep matching up with higher level players than i should. That means the FC matchmaking is slightly broken/or it can be exploited.

      And as far as balance goes, if there s a handful of "good" hunters, whats the point of the rest? In a balanced game, all hunters would be good, if you build your team right, and used the skills properly.

      In an unbalanced game, you can draw a guy like Karl, start buffing him up because thats what you got, and find out he is absolutely useless. Meaning you spent good 2 weeks of grinding on a useless hunter.
      A sign of a broken, unbalanced game.
    • -MsArtsSmith- 2019.03.04 06:44
      Karl isnt completly useless it just takes knowledge to play him correctly knowledge you seem to not have
    • Tohriu 2019.03.04 15:04
      But... You could also get so called end game hunter if you... Dispatched on his trace level annnnnd earned rupees and metron to T3 him
      So stop saying it's unfair when you can get the hunter yourself to almost the same as the one you fought
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:23
      That doesnt fix the problem the game has.
      Do you not understand that?
      What you are saying is "theres a broken hunter in the game, so just exploit it so you can play the game normally".

      This ia something where the devs need to look at their games balance, and think about it.
    • Nazure 2019.03.04 18:03
      as i replied above just now, Karl not useless.
      I invest tons of fortune on him by now. lol

      congrat on pulling Karl, upgrade him to Blue. Being serious here.
    • -MsArtsSmith- 2019.03.04 03:18
      It is just not tier its skill equips everything to factor so even tho same tier that players robin is way higher skill then what you have to offer
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.04 03:29
      Brilliant, you understood tht the opponent had a hunter that had been maxed out further than the 5 in my team.
      That wouldnt happen if i was matched up with another person on the same level as me.
    • Tohriu 2019.03.04 15:21
      Fight Club doesn't revolve around player levels

      It revolves around Fight Club points which determine your rank on Fight Club
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:26
      I dont think you understood what i meant by levels there.
      Im not talking about levels as in level 3 or 5, im talking levels as in im on a level where i only have x amount of good hunters that are not yet maxed out, and my opponents are pn a level where they have multiple fully transcended and maxed out hunters.

      There are context clues there to deduct that.
    • S13Celestial 2019.03.04 03:44
      Lol why so salty. Fc is based off of points. Don't get your panties twisted in a bunch.


      And yes, it's a game where you need to play more for you to get better. That's how gacha games work. Play more or pay.
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.04 04:03
      Since when is pointing out flaws "salty"?
      I was salty when i found out that my 2 months of grinding was absolutely pointless when my whole team was wiped out by one guy.

      In a balanced and not broken game, more you play the better you get, and paying only shortens the grind.
      In an unbalanced and broken game, you pay more to get the unbalanced hunters so you can exploit the broken arena system to stomp newbies.
    • Nazure 2019.03.04 18:09
      you being upset and complain alot here because you lost a fight-club game, after just 2-months grinding?
      not big deal really. I played since 2017 and still lose at pvp sometime lol @@
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:32
      Again, you seem to have missed my point entirely.

      Its not that i lost.
      Its that my entire team of hunters that i thought were good and that i had spent all the time ive played this game to train and improve lost to 1 imbalanced hunter that by any and all logic should be nothing more than evolving fodder.

      Had i not known from the get go how imbalanced this game was, i would have maybe exploited that as well.
    • Izathiel 2019.03.04 04:45
      If you're getting 300 manda a week, you're not a noob anymore. You should consider yourself lucky that you've climbed so high in Fight Club, because you're at a level with people who have been playing for a year. Just shut up, take the 300 manda, and either make your team stronger or quit. Thats all I can tell you, because if you won't listen to Fuku, you won't listen to anyone.
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:35
      The fuck you so salty about?

      Im merely pointing out 2 flaws with the game as i have observed them.
    • DeusEx87 2019.03.04 04:46
      I already told you once ..

      Matchmaking is about your POSITION on the ladder NOT about total FC power, player level or whatever.
      If you will (by miracle) manage to get to top 50 FC, a player that is in position (f.e.) 65 could (and probably will) face you...
      Easy win for him, of course.
      By the same principle a non active player or a player that is losing on purpose (by using just one hunter on his team) will descend the ladder.

      I dont know if you noticed, but every week once FC is over, the individual points are decreased by a certain amount. That means that, no matter how strong someone is, if he stops playing he will descend in the ladder.

      That's why you, with your weak team , could face someone stronger then you even at your level.
      That's how it works... if you don't like it, you can quit...

      I hope you understood the mechanics.
    • SONNYxq 2019.03.04 05:18
      On point here!
    • -MsArtsSmith- 2019.03.04 06:27
      Exactly! So less complaining and just grind
    • S13Celestial 2019.03.04 09:41
      Yeah he's an idiot
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:40
      Do you just realize that you just explained why the matchmaking is broken?
      So inactive players stay on the ladder, and make the climb harder for others lower than them, despite not gaining anything because well, they are inactive.
      Maybe a week of inactivity should get them taken off the ladder?

      And if players can literally abuse the matchmaking ladder by deliberately using weak defense teams to drop tiers, well thats again an exploit, and not something a good game would have.
    • RaynerSin 2019.03.04 09:41

      Quit this game.

      Just quit seriously. Not worth wasting time on this game.

    • Rouges 2019.03.04 10:03
      lol
    • Tohriu 2019.03.04 15:14
      Just so you know...
      We probably all went through this...
      Look at us now, doing fine and dandy being F2P and all
    • Calludus 2019.03.04 16:44
      Hey Jones!

      I can't tell about your complaints if you might face a T3 Robin Max Level or an inferior ones. You haven't stated in your post about that Robin status you mentioned... And lastly how you defeated.. By knockout?... By Time?

      If that Robin might be a T3 Max with at least all level 20 equips and 6x ordinary defense jewels, so you're freaking doomed against your prematured offense hunter team. You know even if Robin is natural 1★ hunter or any other 1★ hunters as well, if well upgraded, they can overpower any hunters with no sufficient levels even if that is a natural 3★ or 4★.

      Robin is an Ice Defense Hunter. The only capable offense hunter in your team to beat Robin is Karl but your Karl is T1 not even max. So I assumed you're overall hunters are at early levels and still not enough to beat even just one hunter with all upgrades they have.

      Power of Stats still the key to Win! The higher the stats, the higher the Power, the more chance to Win! It's just your team line up is very inferior to Robin and so Robin took advantage and comfortably Win them all.

      All hunters are balanced regardless of Tiers. There are lots of methods and ways you can beat them.
      Understand the element basics:
      (Fire, Red, Scissors)
      (Lighting, Yellow, Paper)
      (Ice, Blue, Stone)
      Fire beats Paper, Paper beats Ice, Ice beats Fire..
      Also understand their hunter skill sets and specialties.

      About your current team, Athena and Akasha are not the recommended offense hunters, you as the role of attacker, hence, they're are only good on setting defense and let AI do the tricks thingy. Always remember that you race time on fight club. The AI (Artificial Intelligence) controls the defense hunters and it don't care if you haven't knockout all teams within the TIME LIMIT you're defeated! End up Draw? Like all hunters knocked out, still defeated! TIME IS PRECIOUS! AIM FOR THE HIGHEST ATTACK POWER AS POSSIBLE!
      You don't need a hunter with high defense but low damage if your role is the Attacker.
      If only you replace Akasha with Joy. As if Joy is the only healer with 5th skill Passive Damage or other healers like Crocus will do. Other healers are only for setting defense.
      If only you replace Athena with a bomber, any bombers, All Bombers are built for offense.

      Your team.. seriously, if you upgrade all their skills to Lvl 50 Max and with just some early base levels you got, you might Win because if only you have Two 5★ Bombers: Dino or Patrone or Diana or Lantern or any, One 5★ Joy or Crocus, your T1 5★ Karl and even your 4★ Octavia with no equip/jewels upgrades at all ----versus---- Intermediate T3 Max Robin.... YOU MIGHT WIN!

      PLOT TWIST: A Last Man Standing hides himself with a Superduper Sweet Mother of Monkey Milk just got Level 50 Max Equips, Level 15 Max 6x Defense Jewels, Max Fate Bonus and a T3 Robin might require you to get... Hmmm... at least all T1 Max Base Level Hunters with Level 50 Max Skills, all Level 20 on Three Equips each hunters, Speed+Offense Jewels for Offense Hunters, 6X Offense Jewels for Bombers, and let Joy do her job... Actually... YOU'LL WIN FOR SURE.

      You must take this note that Fight Club don't show the opponent's real overall team power. You might just assuming, this is low and only one hunter and I can beat him... but Surprise! Haha..

      Hope you get this one very long but comprehensive and constructive comment I took effort with.

      Good Day!
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:43
      Read my original comment again, this time with thought.

      Maybe you might notice my 3 bullet points this time.
    • Nazure 2019.03.04 19:12

      agreed with Call. reply just now.

      @Jones:
      My answer to your concern so far.
      1/
      I'm new. Why am I matched up against tough players?
      >> because you fightclub active much.
      >> You've beaten all weak & in-active players, got 300manda per weak.
      >> Things shall get tougher for you now.

      2/
      why my five-person team can't win against a single Robin?
      >> Robin has regen when he cast his skill;
      >> Robin is defense-role and ice element. Your team has Akasha (healer) and Athena (fire-defense) will cause little damage against Robin. Octavia green low-hp not worth consider here.
      >> have you use your rage-bar to casting 3-bar Karl skill continuosly?

      - consider those.
      - Eventually. the better question is "how to beat top-players"; not "why am I have to fight against top-players" lol.

      3/
      how to get better hunter if cannot get manda through high-rank pvp?
      >> actually: still gain manda in pvp, just less than 300 per weak. Save up and pray RNG when doing new recruitment.
      >> not only by manda; can also recruit using scrolls & traces. buy in shop or loots at stages.
      >> weak-team run easy stage, get loots & scrolls. Make stronger team, do harder stages, get more loots. Repeat.
      -------------
      My op.
      - This game is long-run, two months is still early.
      wanna speed things up, spend real money. Not recommended.
      - You won't have enough big-metron to do enough transc. just after two-month.

      fight-club rank is not the only purpose of this game BluStone. Don't let just single one-lost frustrating you.
      Consder other things: the main-story of the game, collect new hunter with much more side-story, live-chat with random folks around the world.

      cheer.

    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:52
      So, if ive beaten all the weak and inactive teams, surely i should be going against others who have done that with similiarly leveled teams as mine, and i should be going against them, instead of players with fully transcended hunters?

      You didnt even touch on the idea that maybe Robin is a bit imbalanced.
      If you have a hunter that can heal itself alone better than a full team with a separate healer, that usually is a sign of imbalance.

      The rest im going to agree with you.

      But you know, main points i had were that the matchmaking is broken and exploitable, and the hunter balance is broken.
    • -ARTEMIS- 2019.03.05 20:53
      It’s not broken, it depends on how u set up and how u played ur team
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.07 19:52
      Except it is.
    • RaynerSin 2019.03.07 21:34

      So apparently i didn't make myself clear enough why you should quit this game...heck it, I got some time to rage some more. Let's do this.

       

      You should quit this game, since it does not, and will never ever, match your perfect ideal of a "balanced" game.

       

      In case you haven't noticed, this game is free to play gatcha game, and it's not made by a big development team with deep pockets like Blizzard (hell, that brand isnt what it used to be). You realise that to keep this type of game's player base and keep their income flowing, they have to keep churning out new characters and keep us wanting new characters and then make us spend on them. It's a gatcha game afterall. It's obviously not made with the intention of primarily competitive play, pvp isn't even real time, so obviously the priority of the developers isn't to keep all the different skills and abilities in perfect balance and make all characters viable, that will mean that there is less incentive for veterans with upgraded hunters to spend on new hunters, thereby hurting their income.

       

      With that said, let's talk about Robin.

       

      He is an example of what I assume is the developers having a weird sense of humor...they occasionally like to give horribly unaesthetic hunters a special edge. Robin is base 1 star, so by normal standards he should be quite weak..but, he has one thing going for him: his character design is one of the worst in game, boring and dull. That means that, like Bruce Bang, the developers love making him overly effective in his role for his level. He has self-heal, but that self-healing scales with his AP instead of his DP, which results in ridiculously high and fluctuating healing values, and since the release of Genovia and the skill balancing patch that followed, they bestowed upon him GENOVIA'S PASSIVE SKILL, which removes stuns, bleeds, disables and debuffs every second. He is an oddity in the game that goes against its pay to win aspirations, though not to the point that he is completely unkillable, I just save up rage and bomb him twice back to back, he will be dead or near enough for bibi to finish him off.


      As for my raging:


      It used to be that u can earn manda via farming events like collecting event only drop items from the expedition areas, and top rankers for those events get quite a handsome amount of manda without having to do fight club, but from the 3 latest such events, the reward pool has been changed to scrolls. It used to be that they will hold lucky draw events that reward lucky winners large sums of manda, but that has changed to scrolls too with the new SNS event. It used to be that every friday we get 15 manda from lottery mouse, now they changed it to scrolls too.

       

      The developers are choking us of manda acquiring channels. Yes they are giving us scrolls, but they also secretly nerfed scroll drop rates of daily searches, they also nerfed recruitment mileage scroll rewards, thus it's a net loss for us. That's how it is. It's either you stay and get more disappointed, or you leave and spare yourself the agony. You decide.

    • Nazure 2019.03.10 01:00
      I never know robin and gienova skill can combo together. Gotta check sometime later.... @@
    • Bonus-Jones 2019.03.10 21:19
      Now think about this situation a bit:
      What you are saying is the game is completely catered towards the few "whales" that pump money into it, and that is how most phone games work, i agree with you on that.

      But that is a source of income, that if not constantly replenished by getting more whales, is not growing.
      And getting more whales hooked only works if people get hooked on your game. Which meand you should also cater to new players.
      Something the devs have apparently overlooked entirely.
    • DeusEx87 2019.03.11 02:41
      Boy, I can understand this kind of complaint from a top tier pvp player that suddenly realizes that, no matter how effort he could put into the game, paying players will always crush him (and this game is NOT the case)

      But , seriously, you are freaking LIGHT YEARS AWAY from a top pvp player.
      Jeez... you ranked up, you found a wall, you sunk back where you belong...
      Get used to it.

      What do you expect? To rank up forever coz you think you are strong therefore you deserve to reach the top?
      Wake up... ALL players in this server, active or not, have their teams on the ladder. And you are gonna face em ALL until they got too high for you or got too low and sunk in the Limbo.

      Told you, this is how it works... Everyone here got there before you, got used to mechanics before you, got better then what you are right now.

      Do you like it? Stop complaining and get strong
      Don't you like it? Stop complaining and quit the game asap.
    • RaynerSin 2019.03.11 09:15
      Ask around. Who starts playing this game, or stays mainly because of its exceptionally balanced gameplay? I can probably count them with one hand.

      The hook is clearly the cute character designs. The art team did a fantastic job, and that they continuously make people swoon over every new waifu, husbando or imouto that comes out, is a vital part of this game's appeal. Just that alone is enough to draw in newbies and keep some people playing and paying. The line and sinker is the daily goals that keeps us in a routine and the event cycles to keep us constantly feeling like something new is on the horizon, despite it being on a rotation.

      And for some of us, it's the nice people we meet on chat that keeps us coming back. The social aspect of this game that makes me stay so long.

      Anyways, soon enough all this will be moot when VS starts to turn non-paid manda into glorified rupees by introducing more limits to what they can be used to buy. Like i said, pay to win aspirations.

      Balancing a game is time intensive...and for VS, it's actually not in their interest financially. Much easier to use moe appeal and tried and true Skinner's Box mechanics to keep players coming back. It''s not to say that the game is not balanced at all, it just needs to feel like it's balanced enough to not pissed off the majority of the players.

      You just happen to be the minority. Thus my advice: wise up. Quit before u invest too much time into this game that's obviously not suitable for you, and it's not gonna contort to your whims. Go play chess.
    • 4tran 2019.03.09 14:13
      If you can get 300 manda every week, that makes you top 320. If you're ranked that high, of course you'll be fighting lots of whales.

      As for idle whales falling down the ladder, the alternative is idle whales camping at the top, nearly impossible to unseat. Is that better?

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